[labnetwork] Surplus equipment shipping
Stephen Howe
info at fabsurplus.com
Thu Mar 23 14:15:44 EDT 2017
Dear Phil,
I think the key points here are the conditions of sale.
If the equipment is sold "as is", without warranty, then you can't rely
on being able to return the goods so therefore they must be inspected
carefully before purchase.
Of course, used equipment can also be purchased with a warranty, in
which case the sales procedure is similar to that as for new equipment
and a return may be possible under the terms of the warranty.
Regarding insurance during the shipping procedure, this is covered by
"Incoterms" , which are explained here:-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incoterms
In any case, regardless of all the problems, we do get a huge volume of
requests for used equipment(More than we can answer, unfortunately.) as
the prices of used tools are generally lower than the prices of new
tools.
Also, it does pay to shop about, as the market is very diversified and
the price you pay for equipment depends a lot on the circumstances of
the seller and how urgently he needs to sell the equipment, especially
with larger 300 mm tools which cost a lot to store and ship.
Yours sincerely,
Stephen Howe
Company Owner
SDI Fabsurplus Group
+1 830 388 1071 (Mobile)
+39 335 710 7756 (Mobile, Italy)
Skype: Stephencshowe
email: info at fabsurplus.com
WWW.FABSURPLUS.COM
Facebook: www.facebook.com/fabsurplus
Twitter: http://twitter.com/fabsurplus
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On Thu, 2017-03-23 at 16:35 +0000, Himmer, Phil wrote:
> Hi Stephen
>
> I apologize for not being more detailed in my email. My primary concern is not necessarily the uncertainty of working with a used equipment broker, I agree many are quite reliable , but the combination of the shipping company and equipment vender. If the tool does not work as the buyer you have limited ability to hold either party responsible.
> As a person who works in this field perhaps you can shed some light on how a buyer can insure a used equipment shipment for damage due to shipping. In my limited experience shippers will not offer insurance on used goods so in effect you are buying as-is not only from the equipment vendor but also the shipping company.
> Appreciate any guidance on this issue will be appreciated as I also like to purchase used tools when possible
>
> Regards
> Phil
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Stephen Howe [mailto:info at fabsurplus.com]
> Sent: Thursday, March 23, 2017 9:58 AM
> To: Himmer, Phil <philh at montana.edu>
> Cc: Abelev, Esta <eabelev at pitt.edu>; labnetwork at mtl.mit.edu
> Subject: Re: [labnetwork] Surplus equipment
>
> Dear Phil,
>
> This is not how the used equipment business works.
>
> They have a great saying that explains this part of the sales procedure in Italian.
> In the Middle Ages, if you wanted to sell a pig, the sales procedure was you took it to the market on a leash and you tried to offer it to people until you found a buyer who satisfied your expectations of value.
>
> In Italy, they say that a wise seller will always "Keep the pig in his hand" until the negotiation is finished and money is exchanged.
>
> If a buyer is purchasing equipment "as is", then they should expect to pay for the equipment 100% down, before the equipment is shipped.
>
> Having said that, of course I would very strongly recommend that one should always carefully inspect in as much detail as possible any item of equipment before it is purchased. No exceptions.
> It is also a very good idea to record as many serial numbers as possible during the inspection and keep a close watch on subsequent operations like crating, because it has happened to me that certain unscrupulous companies (At least one of whom are in the Fortune 500) have removed parts, lost parts or swapped out parts on equipment which I have purchased prior to the equipment leaving the customer dock.
> Personally, I always thoroughly inventory and keep a close eye on the equipment until the crates are sealed and the equipment has been picked up by my forwarder unless I very well know and trust the supplier.
>
> I have been dealing in used semiconductor equipment since 1998, and , I am sorry to say that my confidence in human nature has only declined over the years in the light of my experiences.
>
> The whole area of used equipment is most definitely covered by another Latin saying "Cavit Emptor" i.e. "Buyer beware".
>
> Yours sincerely,
>
> Stephen Howe
> Company Owner
> SDI Fabsurplus Group
>
> +1 830 388 1071 (Mobile)
> +39 335 710 7756 (Mobile, Italy)
>
> Skype: Stephencshowe
> email: info at fabsurplus.com
>
> WWW.FABSURPLUS.COM
>
> Facebook: www.facebook.com/fabsurplus
> Twitter: http://twitter.com/fabsurplus
> Google+: https://plus.google.com/+Fabsurplus
>
>
> On Wed, 2017-03-22 at 19:44 +0000, Himmer, Phil wrote:
> > HI Esta
> >
> >
> >
> > One item I have not seen mentioned on this thread is problem of
> > shipping used goods.
> >
> > Unless the seller is willing to take shipping responsibility, FOB
> > destination, I would suggest that you should not purchase from them.
> > This should not be an issue with reliable vendors. This way the seller
> > is responsible If the tool doesn’t work as promised.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Good luck
> >
> > Phil
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Dr. Phillip Himmer
> > Facility Manager- Montana Microfacrication Facility Montana State
> > University
> >
> >
> >
> > From: Tom Britton
> > Sent: Wednesday, March 22, 2017 1:25 PM
> > To: Abelev, Esta; labnetwork at mtl.mit.edu
> > Subject: Re: [labnetwork] Surplus equipment
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Hi Esta,
> >
> >
> >
> > What Julia writes is very true. When it comes to “used” equipment, you
> > can get everything from a stripped tool with missing parts and
> > obsolete software, no passwords to service the equipment and minimal
> > to no support, to fully-reconditioned equipment with an excellent
> > support network, access to spare parts, field service, warrantees,
> > etc. The old adage that says “if it sounds too good to be true, it
> > probably is” really applies here and it pays to do your homework.
> >
> >
> >
> > That being said, there are a number of companies who actively support
> > the UGIM network, providing either used, rebuilt or reconditioned
> > tools, and are excellent suppliers, going out of their way to make
> > sure that the University cleanrooms are provided with first rate
> > equipment, service and cost savings. When selecting a supplier it is
> > best to make sure they first, have a good reputation; second, have a
> > support team with the technical ability to answer your questions and
> > fix the tools provided; third, have the spare parts to cover the
> > equipment “after” the sale; and fourth, have a warranty that
> > adequately covers the equipment after you buy it. It they don’t have
> > this, understand that your team will need to either hire the support
> > functions or do it themselves. It wasn’t long ago when Universities
> > relied on “donated” equipment and had to make it work, and that can
> > still be a good way to save money if you are set up to support the
> > equipment internally in an “as-is” state.
> >
> >
> >
> > Shameless plug: Our company, Critical Systems, has been providing
> > Universities with professionally reconditioned gas delivery and
> > abatement equipment for over 15 years, and provides the cost savings
> > desired by those on a budget, on equipment that includes full
> > engineering support, on-site startup and training, off the shelf
> > spares, free technical phone support and warrantees that compare to
> > new equipment.
> >
> >
> >
> > I hope this helps.
> >
> >
> >
> > All the best,
> >
> >
> >
> > Tom
> >
> >
> >
> > Tom Britton
> >
> > Director of Sales
> >
> > Critical Systems, Inc.
> >
> > Direct: 208-890-1417
> >
> > Office: 877-572-5515
> >
> > www.CriticalSystemsInc.com
> >
> >
> >
> > logo for email signature png
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > From: labnetwork-bounces at mtl.mit.edu
> > [mailto:labnetwork-bounces at mtl.mit.edu] On Behalf Of
> > julia.aebersold at louisville.edu
> > Sent: Tuesday, March 21, 2017 4:15 PM
> > To: Abelev, Esta <eabelev at pitt.edu>; labnetwork at mtl.mit.edu
> > Subject: Re: [labnetwork] Surplus equipment
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Be very careful with surplused equipment. Many of us have stories of
> > companies that are predators and you should run away from. Rather
> > than a full name shame please e-mail me directly for whom I am
> > referring if interested.
> >
> >
> >
> > Cheers!
> >
> >
> >
> > Julia Aebersold
> >
> > Manager, Micro/Nano Technology Center
> >
> > University of Louisville
> >
> > 2210 South Brook Street
> >
> > Louisville, KY 40292
> >
> > (502)852-1572
> >
> >
> >
> > http://louisville.edu/micronano/
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > From: labnetwork-bounces at mtl.mit.edu
> > [mailto:labnetwork-bounces at mtl.mit.edu] On Behalf Of Abelev, Esta
> > Sent: Tuesday, March 21, 2017 3:49 PM
> > To: labnetwork at mtl.mit.edu
> > Subject: [labnetwork] Surplus equipment
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Dear All,
> >
> >
> >
> > Our facility is looking to acquire following pieces of equipment:
> > thermal evaporator, sputtering tool, spin coaters, hot plates,
> > oxidation oven and RTA. If somebody can recommend a reliable refurb
> > company or may have such an equipment and looking to sell it, please
> > let me know.
> >
> >
> >
> > Thank you, Esta
> >
> >
> >
> > -----------------------
> >
> > Esta Abelev, PhD
> >
> > Technical Director, Petersen Institute of NanoScience and Engineering
> >
> > University of Pittsburgh | 3700 O’Hara Street | 636| Pittsburgh, PA
> > 15261
> >
> > 412-383-4096 | eabelev at pitt.edu | nano.pitt.edu
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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> > labnetwork at mtl.mit.edu
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>
>
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