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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'>I know that some people consider me far too conservative, but I guess the number of incidents (fires, etc.) that I have seen over the past 40 years has led me down that path. I prefer doubly contained piping for hydrogen, with LEL sensors in the generator, VMBs, and tools. I run N2:He in the interstitial at half the delivery pressure of the H2. This is static, and I monitor the interstitial pressure real time. If the pressure goes up, I have a leak in my H2 line. If the pressure goes down, I have a leak in my outer containment. If my pressure goes to zero, someone drove a fork truck through my line and I evacuate the facility.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'>I’m also a believer in excess-flow sensors and fixed orifices. It seems obvious (but I have seen this mistake), but the excess-flow sensor must be set above the flow rate allowed by the orifice </span><span style='font-family:Wingdings;color:#1F497D'>J</span><span style='color:#1F497D'>.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'>We have had a Proton Hogen since we opened the BNC and have been very happy with it. We have had the usual maintenance issues, but nothing serious. John Coy (<a href="mailto:jcoy@purdue.edu">jcoy@purdue.edu</a>) and Kenny Schwartz (<a href="mailto:kfschwar@purdue.edu">kfschwar@purdue.edu</a>) have more solid information that I do. They are the engineers who keep the system running.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'>John<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif";color:#1F497D'>John R. Weaver<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif";color:#1F497D'>Facility Manager<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif";color:#1F497D'>Birck Nanotechnology Center<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif";color:#1F497D'>Purdue University<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif";color:#1F497D'>(765) 494-5494<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif";color:#1F497D'>jrweaver@purdue.edu<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> labnetwork-bounces@mtl.mit.edu [mailto:labnetwork-bounces@mtl.mit.edu] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Abbie Gregg<br><b>Sent:</b> Thursday, July 19, 2012 10:50 PM<br><b>To:</b> Rizik; 'Grimard, Dennis'; labnetwork@mtl.mit.edu; Mark Winter<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [labnetwork] H2 Generators<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Yes, the flow restricting orifice is key, as well as an excess flow sensor in the hydrogen lines, regardless of the source.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Abbie Gregg</span><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>President</span><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Abbie Gregg, Inc.</span><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>1130 East University Drive, Suite 105</span><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Tempe, Arizona 85281</span><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Phone 480 446-8000 x 107</span><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Cell 480-577-5083</span><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>FAX 480-446-8001</span><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>email <a href="mailto:agregg@abbiegregg.com" title="mailto:agregg@abbiegregg.com">agregg@abbiegregg.com</a></span><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>website <a href="http://www.abbiegregg.com" title="http://www.abbiegregg.com/">www.abbiegregg.com</a></span><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:red'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><i><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:navy'>CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: All information contained in or attached to this email constitutes confidential information belonging to Abbie Gregg, Inc., its affiliates and subsidiaries and/or its clients. This email and any attachments are proprietary and/or confidential and are intended for business use of the addressee(s) only. All other uses or disclosures are strictly prohibited. If the reader is not the intended recipient you are hereby notified that the perusal, copying or dissemination of this email is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify the sender, and delete all copies of this message and its attachments immediately</span></i><span style='font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:navy'>. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:blue'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> labnetwork-bounces@mtl.mit.edu [mailto:labnetwork-bounces@mtl.mit.edu] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Rizik<br><b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, July 18, 2012 6:11 PM<br><b>To:</b> 'Grimard, Dennis'; labnetwork@mtl.mit.edu<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [labnetwork] H2 Generators<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='color:#1F497D'>The average cost runs about $6,500 per gas sensor including hardware, programming, sensor, wiring, conduit, functional testing, commissioning, etc. Pull Stations and horn/strobes each runs about $1,500 installed. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='color:#1F497D'>You really got a point there. And yes, you will need to place gas sensors to overlap in the area of work so that they will not miss a gas leak. Although this is quite difficult to achieve, you try to install welded tubing from the generator to the point of use then provide as sensor at each point. Again, cost will be an issue. In a previous email, I mentioned that the gas monitoring system shall be interlocked with the generator to ensure that it shuts down upon gas detection, manual activation and fire alarm signal initiation. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='color:#1F497D'>One more item to consider, is installing an orifice in the tubing leaving the generator to ensure that we do not allow more than 150% of the process gas demand to be supplied to the tools. On past projects, we installed excess flow mechanical valves that would trip if H2 flow rate exceeds a preset limit. This will allow us to limit H2 leakage to a level that would not exceed 25% of the LEL concentration in the lab space. All these parameters MUST be taken in consideration by the engineer of record. Occasionally, these parameters are overlooked and are only discovered during the plan review cycle by the AHJ. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='color:#1F497D'>Regards<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='color:#1F497D'>Rizik Michael, PE<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='color:#1F497D'>Principal<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='color:#1F497D'>Integrated Engineering Services<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='color:#1F497D'>Office: +408 261 3500, Ext. 201<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='color:#1F497D'>Cell: +408 718 0927<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> labnetwork-bounces@mtl.mit.edu [mailto:labnetwork-bounces@mtl.mit.edu] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Grimard, Dennis<br><b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, July 18, 2012 1:37 PM<br><b>To:</b> labnetwork@mtl.mit.edu<br><b>Subject:</b> [labnetwork] H2 Generators<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'>All:<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'>I have been watching the discussion regarding H2 generators. Although I agree with most of what has been said I worry about being able to shut off the generator in case of a leak. The generator does not know that it is delivering into a leak and unless the leak is detected then the generator will continue pumping to that leak. Adding detectors is not the solution. H2 detectors are difficult to place such that they will pick up a leak. Do you add detectors at every possible leak point? Add in the high velocities of the cleanroom and I hesitate to change from bottles to generators.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'>When considering the costs, you also have to consider the cost of the added detectors … which are not cheap …<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'>Dennis Grimard, Ph.D.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'>Managing Director<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'>Lurie Nanofabrication Facility<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'>1246D EECS Blding<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'>1301 Beal Avenue<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'>Ann Arbor, MI 48109-2122<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'>(734) 368-7172 Cell<o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><a href="http://www.lnf.umich.edu">http://www.lnf.umich.edu</a><o:p></o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:.5in'><o:p> </o:p></p></div></body></html>